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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jun 12, 2024 18:46:49 GMT
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Post by smogquixote on Jun 13, 2024 18:28:25 GMT
Lol, at which point does the risk outweigh the reward?
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jun 19, 2024 10:54:50 GMT
New research from Survation shows the proportion of voters who think Keir Starmer would make a better prime minister than Sunak is rising. No surprise when he is already treated like one. There’s been more focus on “Starmer the man” in this campaign than on what he would actually do in office. Few are asking similar questions of the Tories because the polls are supposedly making such questions redundant. Instead, the predicted defeat means that Sunak is regularly being painted as a lame duck by members of his own party
I'm really hoping it's Lib Dems who end up in opposition and not the Tories. Doubt the defeat will be on that scale but you never know. Their ineptitude is there for all to see and so it's only the hardcore who will definitely vote for them
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Post by politician2 on Jun 19, 2024 12:21:51 GMT
I'm really hoping it's Lib Dems who end up in opposition and not the Tories. The Liberal Democrats are the most unprincipled and cynical party in British politics. Their policies are nothing more than bait to attract votes – they simply triangulate by waiting to see what the Tories and Labour are offering, then say whatever the other parties are not proposing. They don't actually believe in anything in their manifestos, as can be seen by all the 180-degree turns they undertook when forming the coalition back in 2010. Or for a concrete example, look at their stance on Brexit. They were the first major party to call for an in/out referendum because the Tories and Labour weren't proposing one. When the referendum was called, they pledged to support whatever result it produced. When the public voted to leave, they immediately started campaigning to overturn the decision without a further referendum using the slogan "Bollocks to Brexit". Whilst I was working in politics in the UK, I discovered that most Labour and Conservative people get on rather well and most Labour and Conservative people hate the Liberal Democrats. There's a reason for that. Never, ever vote Liberal Democrat. Virtually any other option is better.
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Post by wardance on Jun 19, 2024 18:59:03 GMT
Thought this summed things up, and why the Tories will hopefully get hammered. www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2024/jun/19/uk-general-election-2024-live-updates-latest-today-rishi-sunak-tories-labour-reform-ipsos-pollTory government from 2010 to 2024 worse than any other in postwar history, says study by leading experts
As John Stevens reports in a story for the Daily Mirror today, Jeremy Hunt, the chancellor, was complaining at a private Tory dinner earlier this year about the electorate’s “total failure to appreciate our superb record since 2010”. But just how good is the Conservative party’s record in government over the past 14 years? Thankfully, we now have what is as close as we’re going to get to the authoritative, official verdict. Sir Anthony Seldon, arguably Britain’s leading contemporary political historian, is publishing a collection of essays written by prominent academics and other experts and they have analysed the record of the Conservative government from 2010 to 2024, looking at what it has achieved in every area of policy. It is called The Conservative Effect 2010-2024: 14 Wasted Years? and it is published by Cambridge University Press. And its conclusion is damning. It describes this as the worst government in postwar history. Here is the conclusion of the final chapter, written by Seldon and his co-editor Tom Egerton, which sums up the overall verdict. In comparison to the earlier four periods of one-party dominance post-1945, it is hard to see the years since 2010 as anything but disappointing. By 2024, Britain’s standing in the world was lower, the union was less strong, the country less equal, the population less well protected, growth more sluggish with the outlook poor, public services underperforming and largely unreformed, while respect for the institutions of the British state, including the civil service, judiciary and the police, was lower, as it was for external bodies, including the universities and the BBC, repeatedly attacked not least by government, ministers and right-wing commentators. Do the unusually high number of external shocks to some extent let the governments off the hook? One above all – Brexit – was entirely of its own making and will be seen in history as the defining decision of these years. In 2024, the verdict on Brexit is almost entirely negative, with those who are suffering the most from it, as sceptics at the time predicted, the most vulnerable. The nation was certainly difficult to rule in these fourteen years, the Conservative party still more so. Longstanding problems certainly contributed to the difficulties the prime minister faced in providing clear strategic policy, including the 24-hour news cycle, the rise of social media and AI, and the frequency of scandals and crises. But it was the decision of the prime minister to choose to be distracted by the short term, rather than focusing on the strategic and the long term. The prime minister has agency: the incumbents often overlooked it. Overall, it is hard to find a comparable period in history of a Conservative, or other, government which achieved so little, or which left the country at its conclusion in a more troubling state. In their concluding essay, Seldon and Egerton argue that poor leadership was one of the main problems with the 14-year administration. They say that Boris Johnson and Liz Truss were “not up to the job” of being prime minister, and they have a low opinion of most of the other leading figures who have been in government. They say: Very few cabinet ministers from 2010 to 2024 could hold a candle to the team who served under Clement Attlee – which included Ernest Bevin, Nye Bevan, Stafford Cripps, Hugh Gaitskell and Herbert Morrison. Or the teams who served under Wilson, Thatcher or Blair. Michael Gove, Jeremy Hunt and Philip Hammond were rare examples of ministers of quality after 2010 … A strong and capable prime minister is essential to governmental success in the British system. The earlier four periods saw two historic and landmark prime ministers, ie Churchill and Thatcher, with a succession of others who were capable if not agenda-changing PMs, including Macmillan, Wilson, Major and Blair. Since 2010, only Cameron came close to that level, with Sunak the best of the rest. Policy virtually stopped under May as Brexit consumed almost all the machine’s time, while serious policymaking ground to a halt under Johnson’s inept leadership, the worst in modern premiership, and the hapless Truss. Continuity of policy was not helped by each incoming prime minister despising their predecessor, with Truss’s admiration for Johnson the only exception. Thus they took next no time to understand what it was their predecessors were trying to do, and how to build on it rather than destroy it. Seldon’s first book, published 40 years ago, was about Churchill’s postwar administration, and he has been editing similar collections of essays studying the record of administrations since Margaret Thatcher’s. He is a fair judge, and not given to making criticisms like this lightly. The book is officially being published next week, and I’m quoting from a proof copy. In this version, the subtitle still has a question mark after 14 Wasted Years? Judging by the conclusion, that does not seem necessary.
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Post by jsm on Jun 20, 2024 4:32:23 GMT
I like this quote about Rishi Sunak taken from an article about the D-Day commemorations and made in the context of his decision to leave early and get back to the election campaign:
As a PM, Sunak is a miserable combination - a heartless technocrat in thrall to spin-doctors and pollsters.
Full article here:
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jun 20, 2024 7:33:34 GMT
In comparison to the earlier four periods of one-party dominance post-1945, it is hard to see the years since 2010 as anything but disappointing. By 2024, Britain’s standing in the world was lower, the union was less strong, the country less equal, the population less well protected, growth more sluggish with the outlook poor, public services underperforming and largely unreformed, while respect for the institutions of the British state, including the civil service, judiciary and the police, was lower, as it was for external bodies, including the universities and the BBC, repeatedly attacked not least by government, ministers and right-wing commentators. Spot on Just an appalling record At least Keir Starmer gets the concept of public service which will be a massive improvement
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Post by personunknown on Jul 3, 2024 9:19:55 GMT
14 years summed up in four minutes:
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Post by jsm on Jul 3, 2024 22:35:23 GMT
Happy Election Day. Britain needs some good news
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jul 4, 2024 10:35:41 GMT
Just done my civic duty and cast my vote
Seems to me the result was determined months ago, once Boris Johnson and Liz Truss had done their worst.... Partygate and the mini-Budget their definining moments
Then again the Tories have done everything they can during the election to make sure the Tories lose
Self-inflicted mishaps were part of Rishi Sunak’s daily routine.... abandoning D-Day commemorations, close allies gambling on the election date etc
Good riddance
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Post by smogquixote on Jul 4, 2024 15:08:38 GMT
Put your bank balance on it, conservatives will win this election!
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jul 4, 2024 16:43:43 GMT
Put your bank balance on it, conservatives will win this election! 150-1 - that's a helluva payout
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Post by personunknown on Jul 4, 2024 21:26:13 GMT
Put your bank balance on it, conservatives will win this election! 150-1 - that's a helluva payout Damn, didn't get to the bookies in time. Exit Poll in. Labour landslide SNP trounced Labour: 410 Conservatives: 131 Liberal Democrats: 61 Reform: 13 SNP: 10 Plaid Cymru: 4 Green: 2 Other: 19
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Post by smogquixote on Jul 4, 2024 21:31:14 GMT
Put your bank balance on it, conservatives will win this election! 150-1 - that's a helluva payout I told ya! 410 seat landslide, run me my money
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Post by smogquixote on Jul 5, 2024 3:20:25 GMT
Absolute bloodbath this, it looks like the exit poll was incorrect in that it didn’t give Labour even more seats, ministers are dropping like flies!
Edit: Shapps, Baker, Mogg, Penny, Chalk & Coffey all in the mud lol
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