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Post by personunknown on Sept 19, 2021 9:28:10 GMT
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Sept 19, 2021 11:01:36 GMT
Thanks PU - looks interesting
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Post by doug61 on Sept 19, 2021 14:13:56 GMT
I remember liking "Norfolk Coast" when it came out, Have to admire the longevity and success in face of Hugh's departure. It is difficult to get past the bandwagon jumping nature of them and the violence though. Also can't remember one other punk biography of musicians ever having a good word to say about them. Punk prog I suppose they were at heart.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2021 18:17:31 GMT
Out of interest, other than Steve Jones having a go at them on Some Product, what other bands hated them? I can't think of any.
I'd be a liar to say that I didn't like them as they were one of the most prolific bands of the late 70's.
As for being 'bandwagon jumpers', they were never 'orthodox' punks anyway.
Besides wasn't everyone a bandwagon jumper after the Pistols anyway?
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Post by andyloneshark on Sept 19, 2021 19:19:05 GMT
I'm sure for anyone that lived in central New York during the 70s, hung out at CBGBs & Max's and was part of the underground scene there, the whole 'band wagon jumpers' accusation could just as easily be applied to the entire early London Punk scene. A quick look and listen to Lou Reed, Suicide, Richard Hell, The Ramones etc etc, could arguably justify that.
If you listen to The Stranglers demo version of 'Down In The Sewer' from 1975 you will hear it's not that much different in tempo and aggressive tone to the final version that we all know from their first album two years later. JJ has mentioned that alot of the future famous names of the London Punk scene would be in the audience at their gigs with their long hair and bellbottoms.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2021 21:41:00 GMT
The 'bandwagon' jumpers argument is a pointless, circular argument.
As I've said many times, the Pistols defined punk as we all came to know it.
Interesting, however that the Stranglers predated all the early UK punk bands and were castigated by them.
I certainly would consider some of their songs 'punk' songs and some I wouldn't but at the end of the day does it really matter?
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Post by andyloneshark on Sept 20, 2021 5:57:45 GMT
The older i get, the less i could give a hoot about who jumped on who's band wagon, i was merely replying to previous posts that mentioned that - The Adverts and Buzzcocks could be accused of being band wagon jumpers too, but what fantastic bands they were.
i think the thing to remember is how much all the London bands were in ferocious competition with each other, there was very little unity there at all, alot of animosity, so The Stranglers were true outsiders, they were older already, had some history, and worst of all, had the musical chops of a 'Prog' band... sacré bleu!
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Post by zeopold on Sept 20, 2021 7:07:42 GMT
In the interests of fairness it should be pointed out that some bandwagon jumpers, like The Drones, had merit.
However, I draw the line at bandwagon jumpers featuring; - Bernard Manning - style lyrics - Strippers - Karate experts throwing their weight around - A bloke with a ‘tache noodling on his organ a la Rick Wakeman
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2021 9:16:42 GMT
The older i get, the less i could give a hoot about who jumped on who's band wagon, i was merely replying to previous posts that mentioned that - The Adverts and Buzzcocks could be accused of being band wagon jumpers too, but what fantastic bands they were. i think the thing to remember is how much all the London bands were in ferocious competition with each other, there was very little unity there at all, alot of animosity, so The Stranglers were true outsiders, they were older already, had some history, and worst of all, had the musical chops of a 'Prog' band... sacré bleu! The average of the Pistols in 1975 was 19 whereas the Stranglers was 28! I'm glad that the Stranglers never followed the Pistols template, it's what made their sound unique. As for bandwagon bands?Who cares as no one was there at the beginning as there was no beginning anyway.
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loz
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Post by loz on Sept 20, 2021 10:51:25 GMT
In the interests of fairness it should be pointed out that some bandwagon jumpers, like The Drones, had merit. However, I draw the line at bandwagon jumpers featuring; - Bernard Manning - style lyrics - Strippers - Karate experts throwing their weight around - A bloke with a ‘tache noodling on his organ a la Rick Wakeman I am not the greatest Stranglers fan, but I feel I have to defend them a bit here. Bernard Manning lyrics... I presume you mean songs like Nubile s ? A cracking song that at the time suited the sleazy men in black type image, although I admit the song is looked at differently 40 years on. Strippers... The song Nice n Sleazy with the strippers dancing was pure show and again suited the song and was just a bit of show business...The same could be charged at Splodgnessabounds and even the sex pistols film with Mary Middleton , Plasmatics ?? Karate...Just showing that they were not to be messed with ? A la Rick Wakeman...a bit unfair to someone who liked wearing a tache and there was no "punk" uniform back then, the keyboards broought a bit of darkness to a lot of the early stuff I thought personally.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2021 11:32:37 GMT
I had no problem with the Strippers!
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Post by doug61 on Sept 20, 2021 12:31:14 GMT
The 'bandwagon' jumpers argument is a pointless, circular argument. As I've said many times, the Pistols defined punk as we all came to know it. Interesting, however that the Stranglers predated all the early UK punk bands and were castigated by them. I certainly would consider some of their songs 'punk' songs and some I wouldn't but at the end of the day does it really matter? I'd personally differentiate it as bands that started up through being excited by punk into doing it themselves and those that were already in existence doing their chosen type of music who saw an opportunity to make money out of this new "fashion" so adapted their sound to fit the "zeitgeist. They to me would be the "Bandwagon Jumpers" Can't agree with the Pistols thing either, They defined a particular offshoot of punk which had a "glam" basis (the London sound, maybe) but You had the Heartbreakers who influenced so many and had a more rock 'n' Roll grounding, Patti and others doing the art punk thing and the Ramones doing the 100 mph thing. The Pistols may have influenced how you saw Punk but I would guess that everyone "got" punk differently. For me personally it was through the Dolls and Heartbreakers then Pistols/Clash sound (I personally saw the Pistols as too cartoony although loved the stuff they were coming out with, Cook aside they were a bit embarrassing to like as they gave off a rather buffoonish air) The early Stranglers singles were fantastic though, "Heroes" has to be up there with the very best.
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Post by zeopold on Sept 20, 2021 12:31:28 GMT
- A bloke with a ‘tache noodling on his organ a la Rick Wakeman unfair to someone who liked wearing a tache That's a contradiction in terms. If you want to wear a 'tache join the Brotherhood of Man or the Village People.
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Post by doug61 on Sept 20, 2021 12:32:59 GMT
In the interests of fairness it should be pointed out that some bandwagon jumpers, like The Drones, had merit. However, I draw the line at bandwagon jumpers featuring; - Bernard Manning - style lyrics - Strippers - Karate experts throwing their weight around - A bloke with a ‘tache noodling on his organ a la Rick Wakeman I am not the greatest Stranglers fan, but I feel I have to defend them a bit here. Bernard Manning lyrics... I presume you mean songs like Nubile s ? A cracking song that at the time suited the sleazy men in black type image, although I admit the song is looked at differently 40 years on. Strippers... The song Nice n Sleazy with the strippers dancing was pure show and again suited the song and was just a bit of show business...The same could be charged at Splodgnessabounds and even the sex pistols film with Mary Middleton , Plasmatics ?? Karate...Just showing that they were not to be messed with ? A la Rick Wakeman...a bit unfair to someone who liked wearing a tache and there was no "punk" uniform back then, the keyboards broought a bit of darkness to a lot of the early stuff I thought personally. They had strippers on stage when they did some open air gigs too. then again, Stacia anyone? Different times.
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Post by doug61 on Sept 20, 2021 12:34:34 GMT
unfair to someone who liked wearing a tache That's a contradiction in terms. If you want to wear a 'tache join the Brotherhood of Man or the Village People. Phil was the exception.
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