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Post by politician2 on Jun 15, 2020 11:37:40 GMT
Yes, there has been a definite shift to the right among Northern voters, particularly (and perhaps surprisingly) within former mining communities. I was referring to potential shifts to the left (including significant investment in those communities) by the Tories in order to retain those seats.
As for Starmer, he certainly represents a significant shift to the right by Labour. He also represents their best hope of getting re-elected, as appointing Long-Bailey would have constituted electoral suicide.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2020 12:31:28 GMT
Yes, there has been a definite shift to the right among Northern voters, particularly (and perhaps surprisingly) within former mining communities. I was referring to potential shifts to the left (including significant investment in those communities) by the Tories in order to retain those seats. As for Starmer, he certainly represents a significant shift to the right by Labour. He also represents their best hope of getting re-elected, as appointing Long-Bailey would have constituted electoral suicide. Yes, its tactical not political. Placate white racist Labour voters materially. Its nothing new. Do you really think Labour will get re-elected? Seriously? That balloon Starmer couldn't manage a hardon never mind a country. Most voters in Scotland have never heard of whatsisname who leads Labour here. Conversely, Sturgeon is getting even stronger despite the Salmond scandal.
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Post by politician2 on Jun 15, 2020 12:37:13 GMT
Do I think Labour could get elected in 2024? Yes, I think it's entirely possible, given the way in which the Conservative Government has handled the coronavirus crisis. Of course, the real acid test will be how Brexit pans out, especially as we now appear to be heading towards a no-deal outcome.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2020 12:46:44 GMT
Do I think Labour could get elected in 2024? Yes, I think it's entirely possible, given the way in which the Conservative Government has handled the coronavirus crisis. Of course, the real acid test will be how Brexit pans out, especially as we now appear to be heading towards a no-deal outcome. Surprised at that. One thing's for sure theres more chance of Jim Davidson joining the SWP than Labour getting voted in here.
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Post by politician2 on Jun 15, 2020 12:56:12 GMT
I agree that Labour is unlikely to do well in Scotland: the SNP has well and truly stolen its turf, leaving the Conservatives as the natural party of choice for those who don't subscribe to a centre-left worldview. But in the UK in general? Impossible to make predictions at this stage, but I certainly wouldn't rule out a Labour victory as they're moving away from the hardline leftism of the Corbyn years.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2020 13:09:08 GMT
I agree that Labour is unlikely to do well in Scotland: the SNP has well and truly stolen its turf, leaving the Conservatives as the natural party of choice for those who don't subscribe to a centre-left worldview. But in the UK in general? Impossible to make predictions at this stage, but I certainly wouldn't rule out a Labour victory as they're moving away from the hardline leftism of the Corbyn years. The Tories are slurping up the right wing working class Orange vote, the white racists and the donkeys who will vote for anyone other than the SNP. A motley bunch of misfits indeed.
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jun 15, 2020 14:03:43 GMT
I'd have thought without Scotland Labour would not manage a majority but I haven't look at whether there are sufficient constituencies in England and Wales for them to theoretically get a majority
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jun 15, 2020 14:06:46 GMT
You mean the definition of the word diversion? No why is it a diversion. I just mean it diverted me from thinking about Labour and the election into something that I'd never heard about before. I didn't ponder the merits of your original statement which, I now realise, was remiss
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2020 16:13:38 GMT
No why is it a diversion. I just mean it diverted me from thinking about Labour and the election into something that I'd never heard about before. I didn't ponder the merits of your original statement which, I now realise, was remiss The Labour Party will never get into power unless they start mimicking a rightwing hybrid of the Tories/ Brexit party. Their role is to control the white working class and they're not doing that properly. Exemplified by how the racists of the Tory Party/Brexit party have made huge inroads into their traditional constituencies.🙄
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2020 16:14:42 GMT
I'd have thought without Scotland Labour would not manage a majority but I haven't look at whether there are sufficient constituencies in England and Wales for them to theoretically get a majority The Labour Party are finished in Scotland. About time too.
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jun 26, 2020 11:44:58 GMT
So Keir Starmer is willing to act decisively on the issue of anti-semitism in the Labour Party
That said, I'm not sure he'd have chosen this particular way to make a point as it sets him in conflict with the party's left
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2020 12:25:27 GMT
Because a tweet had a link saying that 'taking a knee' originated from the Israeli Secret Service?
I would criticise Israel for what it does in a whole number of ways.
In no way that does that make me or anyone anti semitic.
'Sir' Keir is a complete and utter arsehole and says that he will campaign against Independence here and he expects to pick up votes!!
Yet another Red Tory Blairite.
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jun 26, 2020 13:36:30 GMT
It's not "taking a knee" Rogue Rebecca Long-Bailey described the actor Maxine Peake as a "diamond" when she shared an Independent interview with Peake in which she claimed that the tactics used by the police in America, kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, were learnt from seminars with Israeli secret services
So, ask yourself, why are Israeli security services being fingered as any more responsible for this killing than those of the UK, or France, or any of the many police forces which use & share aggressive restraint techniques?
Why is Peake (an actor) singling out the world’s only Jewish majority state as the point of origin for the killing of an African-American? More significantly, why not the USA, where the killing actually took place?
It's one of many examples of a common pattern (esp amongst many on the left) of placing Israel at the heart of a global web of evil, no matter what the truth might be
I doubt whether Rebecca Long-Bailey is, or thinks of herself, as anti-semetic but it's this type of lazy willingness to mindlessly propogate inaccurate propaganda and outmoded stereotypes that many Jewish people (and many non-Jewish) understandably feel is unacceptable.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2020 14:23:50 GMT
Yes I know it's not taking a knee. The reason I used this was to be ironic.
I can 't speak for Long or Maxine Peake but I will say this the Israeli secret services(as do the IDF)use worst practice than that including the breaking of children's joints with bricks, rifles or any other heavy and blunt objects.
My point being is that although State services around the world use torture and brutal methods of 'restraint'(including Britain in Iraq and Ireland), Israel shouldn't be seen to escape such scrutiny, especially when they are one of the biggest offenders!
The real point is that any corelation between human rights abuses and Israel is seen to be person non grata now which is exactly what the pro Zionist'lobby'wants.
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Jun 26, 2020 14:36:36 GMT
The Israeli security forces are guilty of appalling crimes under international law, and of human rights violations meted out to Palestinians We all know that
All the more reason to be precise, and factually accurate, when criticising Israel - and also not to conflate being critical of Israel with being anti-semetic With that in mind, Starmer was right to take decisive action against RLB, and Peake was right to backtack and to apologise
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