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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2022 18:00:49 GMT
You've just contradicted yourself. Because England got to the last 8 that makes them the 8th best team in the world.
You said that.👍
It's not biased. It's based on results like all football matches
Think beyond close minded English nationalism, be objective👍
If its not about the 'winner',why take part? Presumably, it was irrelevant that England beat West Germany in 1966 then?
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Dec 12, 2022 19:06:43 GMT
I was joking - being literal, I thought you'd appreciate it given your own methodology. Ah well
Clearly the FIFA rankings are the most objective measure of CURRENT FORM, adjusting as they do for one anomalous good tournament
"If its not about the 'winner', why take part?"
I genuinely DO believe it is about the taking part and not the winning
Winning is great, and it's what informs the narrative, but there's as much interest, probably more, in the margins - ask Wales, Iceland etc, even Scotland and Ireland fans in tournaments gone by
After all, you don't measure musical worth by who gets the biggest sales, otherwise here we'd all be talking about Ed Shearan, Green Day, U2 etc
Anyways, I am really bored of this conversation now. If you ever have the inclination perhaps you could explain why the FIFA rankings are not a helpful and reliable measure of CURRENT FORM - otherwise let's call it a day
NB That's CURRENT FORM not historical success going back decades and as solely measured by the narrow definition of tournament wins
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2022 20:13:58 GMT
You actually seem to be somersaulting about what it is you're actually arguing here.🤔
Saying that sport is just about competing without winning might be the reasons why SOME people want to watch it but ask any lower league football team in the English FA cup competing against the likes of Arsenal, Man City etc if they go into the match wanting to lose, they'd just laugh 😅
They might be expecting to get beat but no-one enters a competition WANTING to get beat.
You seem to be arguing incessantly that CURRENT form is the most important factor in football. I think you're arguing this because you don't really have anywhere to go. 👍
As a tier 3 team in World football, England don't meet the criteria for either. An appalling historical record and a current one that has won fuck all either.
Which begs the question? I take it you don't want England to win a major trophy if it's just about competing?
If England's standing is rising, why are they thinking of getting a new manager ffs?
You're right about the argument getting boring as you clearly have no rhyme or reason to your argument.
Always a doomed and exasperated way of debating 👍
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Dec 12, 2022 20:43:19 GMT
God this is boring
I never claimed any supporter wants to get beat, only that winning is not the be all and end all - far from it
I never claimed that current form is the most important factor in football - only that England's current form is reflected in the FIFA rankings, something you consistently dispute
I wish I'd never bothered TBH, I've lost the will to live
I don't support England or particularly care if they win or lose
As I said pages ago, I'd rather they didn't win at present as English exceptionalism is over inflated & it would be fuelled by a tournament win, and the sooner we realise we need to co-operate with other countries the better
My point has been consistent throughout: England's current form is reflected in the FIFA rankings. I don't care about England but your original assertion was wrong and remains wrong
You disagree
Fine
Let's move on
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2022 8:25:00 GMT
Tier 3. You know it's true.👍
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Post by doug61 on Dec 13, 2022 12:20:40 GMT
Honestly can't tell if this is a wind up, calling a side that constantly makes the last 8 and is viewed that way in all rankings, and even more importantly, and completely unbiased, from a worldwide betting point of view, a "3rd tier" side either shows you have no understanding of football or are ridiculously biased against the English. You can pick which one, but the bookmakers never set odds because they like or dislike teams, they do it based on probability and form and results, you are just looking for any way to bend facts to put down a country you have a problem with. Rogue is sincere. He genuinely does not believe he is biased against England The irony is "the evidence" is there for anyone to read. This thread is a classic example And don't get rogue started on The Labour Party, New Order, Postcard Records, the West End of Glasgow, Hipsters etc etc Bizarre, impossible to just ignore inconvenient facts to make something fit. Mind you, I can't think of much that was listenable that came off "Postcard" either. |
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Post by doug61 on Dec 13, 2022 12:24:03 GMT
I give up Do you really not understand these two words... CURRENT FORM?* "So what you're now saying that people support football knowing that they know that they're going to win fuck all?"Yes. Amazing isn't it? 🤩 Your big club sense of entitlement is extraordinary "Some wee teams are just happy to compete against the big teams"Or, ever considered this, it's their local team, they enjoy the matchday experience and meeting up with pals, and they still go knowing they'll win nothing - that is what most fans experience every season. It may be enlived by a relegation dogfight or a flirtation with the playoffs, or maybe a cup run. Most teams have very few honours Even in the Prem, Brighton, Palace and Fulham have never won a major trophy - makes you wonder why 25,000 + people go and watch them every home game? 🙄 In 54 years of going to my lot, winning the Youth Cup once in the late 70's is the single cup success, Football is nothing to do with glory hunting, it's about community and consoling each other about how crap we are. Can't think of a single side that has been improved by success. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2022 12:31:46 GMT
Rogue is sincere. He genuinely does not believe he is biased against England The irony is "the evidence" is there for anyone to read. This thread is a classic example And don't get rogue started on The Labour Party, New Order, Postcard Records, the West End of Glasgow, Hipsters etc etc Bizarre, impossible to just ignore inconvenient facts to make something fit. Mind you, I can't think of much that was listenable that came off "Postcard" either. Something fit?😄 The only thing that's bizarre is you.👍 You're the ones that bang on about 1966 all the time but when you win fuck all, it's suddenly not about success but'competing' and 'community'. Hypocrisy, arrogance and entitlement all rolled into one. |
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Post by doug61 on Dec 13, 2022 12:32:38 GMT
I hope Southgate decides to stay, he's done alot to transform and motivate the England team and chooses his words when dealing with the cynical media, with calm wisdom. I know very little about football these days, but even i remember ...it wasn't that long ago, we could even beat a part-time team of Icelandic Dentists!  Can't agree, and the decision shouldn't even be his to make. we beat teams we are expected to beat and we fail when we face teams where it will be tricky.We will always have one of the top squads available in the world and that bit of difference that jumps us from QF to SF and Finalists/winners has to come from tactics and the ability to change things during play. Southgate has shown himself incapable of doing that at every turn. He is in the job because he is an FA man through and through, will never rock the boat, will have nice relationships with the media etc etc, not because he is a top tier manager. I doubt there would be more than 1 or 2 EPL clubs that would employ him if he was on the market as has been a poor club manager at every chance. You only had to watch the dreary repetitive flat passing far too deep against inferior opposition to know what the future will continue to hold. Not sure who would be best replacement, but we can go no further with Southgate, that's for sure. |
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Dec 13, 2022 13:42:32 GMT
You're the ones that bang on about 1966 all the time.... Who here "bangs on" about 1966? You're the only person who ever mentions it 🙄 I was four in 1966 and have never spoken to anyone about it, either in person or online Admittedly it does get referenced from time to time in the media - when one of them dies for example (can't be many left now) - but that's about it these days Maybe in days gone by but not these days You're the ones that bang on about 1966 all the time.... My arse |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2022 14:05:34 GMT
We've just been talking about it earlier in this thread.😄
Have a look👍
Context is everything. The problem with Doug and Right wing nationalists like him, is that they aren't talking about football at all. It's just a vehicle.
As for the media not talking about 1966.😄 It's mentioned in every report AND every game which features the England team.
I think you've possibly become immune to it so you don't even notice they're doing it👍
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Post by Lord Emsworth on Dec 13, 2022 14:08:52 GMT
I've gone back five pages and checked every post - you're the only poster who has mentioned 1966 (repeatedly too). No one else
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2022 14:11:21 GMT
So we haven't discussed 1966 whatsoever?
I think you have to re-read those posts.
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Post by doug61 on Dec 13, 2022 15:36:55 GMT
We've just been talking about it earlier in this thread.😄 Have a look👍 Context is everything. The problem with Doug and Right wing nationalists like him, is that they aren't talking about football at all. It's just a vehicle. As for the media not talking about 1966.😄 It's mentioned in every report AND every game which features the England team. I think you've possibly become immune to it so you don't even notice they're doing it👍 Oh, and we are back to me being a "right wing nationalist". Only one bigot on this board has ever chosen to attack one country on just about every subject that comes up. Wonder who that is, and who the country is. My God, you need some vinegar with that chip.  |
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Post by doug61 on Dec 13, 2022 15:41:04 GMT
I've gone back five pages and checked every post - you're the only poster who has mentioned 1966 (repeatedly too). No one else apparently, if HE brings it up and you answer his post then YOU are obsessed with it and not him. Work that one out. |
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